The reason for this email is to ask your experience in working with elderly individuals on meds. An all too common problem.

A current case involves a 75 year old female for whom Nat Mur appears to be the best suited remedy for the total case. Given her current low vitality, we started with 12c in water and suggested it be sipped 4 times during the day for a few days, then call me. She reported no 'big' improvement, but family reported there was a wee bit of improvement. She is frustrated at the lack of immediate changes - but I think her level of frustration links back to anxiety and depression caused by the meds. Then 30c was tried. Unfortunately, her MD raised her dosage of meds and she was too sleepy to remember to take the remedy after the one dose, but she conveyed the impression the single 30 had no effect. A single dose of 200C about 2 weeks later had no obvious effect. Now she is more depressed, more sleepy, more unsure of her footing when walking, and her original symptoms are more pronounced - all of which I believe can be traced to the increased meds - but I am the only one with this point of view.

What is needed is a way to give her a boost, and clear her mind a bit. I think once she is more her old self she will see the problem and work with her MD to reduce (and I pray eliminate) these meds [she was a fiesty and determined individual so I'm hopeful she could regain that ability to take control of the situation]. I am unfamiliar with using higher potencies with my elderly cases, and rather rarely use them in other cases.

To bring this back to an appropriately academic discussion - In such situations [long term effects of meds and low vitality] do you think a higher potency would be appropriate to give the needed boost? or another remedy? Ideally I would be more patient - but in my elderly cases, I sometimes feel the meds will kill them before homeopathy can help them.

Thank you in advance for sharing your experiences.

Donna

I'm feeling exceptionally frustrated. Once I saw mostly elderly with long standing long list of meds that hindered remedies from working effectively - or just slowed the process. Now - seems like everyone I see has a medicine cabinet full - and more 'over the counter' junk they don't even consider as meds. Part of the problem is they only seek out 'alternative' care after they have exhausted the 'traditional' circuit. I get them when the 'traditional' group has given them over to 'management' and has sapped all hope of a cure, as well as their vital energy, yet they are still unable to part with their doctors or pharmaceuticals, and legally, I can not suggest they stop - only that they 're-evaluate' them. Sorry for the rant - I just watched a family loose a beautiful young girl who had been cut up and poisoned (by MDs) and I am between anger and despair. They brought her to me a few months ago - and I believe homeopathy helped her and the family - but she was still being poisoned by chemo drugs the doctors acknowledged would not help - but refused to stop giving her - since they felt they needed to do something.

I know this is a frustrating situation to be in.
If you are sure Nat Mur is the correct remedywhy don't you try her on an LM dose?
However, realistically, if the medications she is on are causing her problems and she is determined to stay on them then maybe nothing will work- they will act as a maintaining cause??!!

Dear Donna
Hoppit has a good point.
Yes i see this all the time,it is truly frustrating.As a homeopath you can only do so much,the patient has to be willing. If they are an adult they can make up their own mind as to what they want to use as medication or not. As a child it's a bigger problem,the parents have the final say. You can print information on the toxic adverse effects of the specific meds they are on and show them. Many patients do not do their homework as to the allopathic meds they digest. Its often that the cause of their ailment IS DUE TO THEIR ALLOPATHIC MEDS.

I have been in your shoes many times. You can encourage them to take the steps of stopping their allopathic meds but it ultimatly has to be their own doing not yours. Patients are brainwashed by their allopaths into taking toxic drugs for life,making them more ill than ever. You can apeal to their logic.......if you must take a drug daily for the rest of your life it is NOT a cure it is only palliation/suppression. Homeopathy does not work this way.
Another idea is have them contact one of your 'other' patients that has been through the same just for support.
My own mother is a great example of a senior citizen. She was cured by homeopathy of her chronic RA of 20+ yrs. She was on hundreds of different allopathic meds nothing worked! 20 yrs of this non-sense nothing worked!!!!!!
The minute she started taking homeopathy she started getting well,now she does not take even one pill not even asprin................nothing...................Fo r an acute cold/fever she only takes homeopathics. So i have all my senior citizen patients talk to her,to show it is possible to do without allopathics.

Gina Tyler

__________________
"Great ideas often recieve violent opposition from mediocre minds"...................Einstein

I find my most effective tool is the med sheets that are available from the
pharmacist-- what I do is compare the presenting sx with the side effects of
the meds, and help the client/family frame the conversation with the md or
pharmacist. This has worked well for me-- however, it is a slow go as they
decrease meds 1-2 at a time, and slowly, usually.

Often I find that as a remedy is taken, side effects increase and when the
meds are decreased the "side effect' sx go away.
Warning: this is one of those time management sinkholes for practioners...
:)


beth
----- Original Message -----
From: "DCR" <drona (AT) earthlink (DOT) net>
To: "homeopathy list" <homeopathy (AT) homeolist (DOT) com>; "minutus"
<minutus (AT) yahoogroups (DOT) com>
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 9:58 AM
Subject: [H] elderly on many meds


> The reason for this email is to ask your experience in working with
elderly individuals on meds. An all too common problem.
>
> A current case involves a 75 year old female for whom Nat Mur appears to
be the best suited remedy for the total case. Given her current low
vitality, we started with 12c in water and suggested it be sipped 4 times
during the day for a few days, then call me. She reported no 'big'
improvement, but family reported there was a wee bit of improvement. She is
frustrated at the lack of immediate changes - but I think her level of
frustration links back to anxiety and depression caused by the meds. Then
30c was tried. Unfortunately, her MD raised her dosage of meds and she was
too sleepy to remember to take the remedy after the one dose, but she
conveyed the impression the single 30 had no effect. A single dose of 200C
about 2 weeks later had no obvious effect. Now she is more depressed, more
sleepy, more unsure of her footing when walking, and her original symptoms
are more pronounced - all of which I believe can be traced to the increased
meds - but I am the only one with this point of view.
>
> What is needed is a way to give her a boost, and clear her mind a bit. I
think once she is more her old self she will see the problem and work with
her MD to reduce (and I pray eliminate) these meds [she was a fiesty and
determined individual so I'm hopeful she could regain that ability to take
control of the situation]. I am unfamiliar with using higher potencies with
my elderly cases, and rather rarely use them in other cases.
>
> To bring this back to an appropriately academic discussion - In such
situations [long term effects of meds and low vitality] do you think a
higher potency would be appropriate to give the needed boost? or another
remedy? Ideally I would be more patient - but in my elderly cases, I
sometimes feel the meds will kill them before homeopathy can help them.
>
> Thank you in advance for sharing your experiences.
>
> Donna
>
> I'm feeling exceptionally frustrated. Once I saw mostly elderly with long
standing long list of meds that hindered remedies from working effectively -
or just slowed the process. Now - seems like everyone I see has a medicine
cabinet full - and more 'over the counter' junk they don't even consider as
meds. Part of the problem is they only seek out 'alternative' care after
they have exhausted the 'traditional' circuit. I get them when the
'traditional' group has given them over to 'management' and has sapped all
hope of a cure, as well as their vital energy, yet they are still unable to
part with their doctors or pharmaceuticals, and legally, I can not suggest
they stop - only that they 're-evaluate' them. Sorry for the rant - I just
watched a family loose a beautiful young girl who had been cut up and
poisoned (by MDs) and I am between anger and despair. They brought her to
me a few months ago - and I believe homeopathy helped her and the family -
but she was still being poisoned by chemo drugs the doctors acknowledged
would not help - but refused to stop giving her - since they felt they
needed to do something.
>

Very interesting about the increase in side effects that
you see. Can you say more?

Sherill

> I find my most effective tool is the med sheets ...
> Often I find that as a remedy is taken, side effects
increase and when the
> meds are decreased the "side effect' sx go away.