Lets get a few things clear here first.
'Won't they have got better anyway?'
I've heard this argument SO many times now.
My first experience with Homeopathy was waiting for a prescription in Boots, a UK chemist (pharmacy). While I was sitting there I read an article in a pamphlet about a Homeopathic 'remedy' called Aconite that was very good for croup. As my baby son had had a few attacks of the croup, I was interested that here was a Boots-own leafllet saying that Homeopathy was gentle and safe for children and babies. So, I bought a bottle of Aconite 6c.
No instructions came with the bottle. I just popped it in the kitchen cupboard and forgot all about it.
A few weeks later, my baby son woke me up in the early hours, wheezing and coughing and crying. Another attack of the croup.
I got him out of his cot and took him downstairs to the kitchen and put on the kettle to fill the room with steam, something my GP and mother-in-law had suggested to help ('cos my husband used to have croup when he was a baby).
Then I remembered the Aconite I had bought so I thought I would give it a go. I got one tablet out of the bottle, crushed it between two spoons (my son was too young to have teeth to chew it) and popped the powder onto his tongue......and waited......SECONDS later he stopped crying, then his breathing became normal, then the wheezing sound stopped....and he was back to normal, smiling and happy like it had never happened.
'WOW' I thought, 'Why did THAT happen?'.

This was MY experience with Homeopathy. I wasn't a Homeopath, I had a nice GP, I'd never used Homeopathy and the first remedy I did use, on my son, worked a treat. I then spent the next 5 years studying as much as I could about the subject.
That 'WOW' still happens now. I'm a Mum, I have a kiddie, I'm trained in Red Cross First Aid and have used Homeopathic remedies such as Arnica for bruises, Aconite for shock and panic, Ignatia for grief, for his friends, his friends Mums and Dad's and kiddies too. I use Homeopathy almost everyday of the week, even when I'm off duty someone somewhere will come into my orbit and I've got Arnica and Aconite and Ignatia in my handbag.
SO DON'T GIVE ME ANY OF THAT 'HE WOULD HAVE GOT BETTER ANYWAY' RUBBISH..........

Croup doesn't 'Go' of its own accord. I'd seen my son struggle for breath, scared, panicky, crying too many times before to know that it didn't 'just get better' of its own accord.

So, I don't need to 'address' any arguments with Richard Dawkins. I've never met the man and am highly unlikely to. If I'd accepted the invitation from his publicist to be on his silly programme I might have met him. But why should I fight with a man who is on a mission to bring into disrepute the men and women working with hearts full of compassion for their fellow man, who have nearly ALL used Homeopathy themselves, who see with their own little beady eyes every day someone recover from a condition or complaint or illness?
My first experience 'opened my eyes'. If it had never happend, my son had never had the Aconite,I wouldn't be working in a field I love would I?
Why should I have to argue with some big-wig when I've got plenty of clients (1,500 at the last count) who use Homeopathic remedies, and my friends and family?
Why should I waste my breath 'trying' to get someone to change their mind??????????????
If he's that bothered about all us Homeopaths using highly diluted remedies, he should remember that the biggest reason for hospital admission is an reaction to a 'prescribed' medicine.
He's made his mind up and his theory of virus' should tell him that humans learn BEST from personal experience, not from some peer-reviewed bit of paper, not some bod in a white suit in a lab, but from real people in the real world.
He's wrong because he LIKES being the centre of attention and winding people up. He LIKES getting into verbal fights with people. He hasn't slowed down enough to actually try a remedy, or see a Homeopath.
Homeopathy isn't a belief system or magic. Its a form of gentle medicine coupled with a complete understanding of the nature of human beings.
An illness doesn't come from outside the self, it comes from inside so until he graps this fact, he's skating on ice.
And do YOU use Homeopathy?
Have YOU ever used a remedy?
If you've never been ill, then you might not but there are plenty of people in the world who for whatever reason ARE ill and to have some grumpy old scientist tell them its 'evil' is all showmanship.

Where is Dawkins love of the human race? He studied animals!! He has no idea of body language and if you watch him on the telly he constantly looks away from the people he interviews, he can't even make eye contact with them AND he interviews them standing-up???

How is that caring or commited to helping anyone?
Its like being 'in the ring' in a boxing match.

Homeopaths are trained not only in remedies but also in getting to the root of someones problems.
We don't skim the surface like the medical world, we get in deep and get to the real problem, whatever that might be.....and as I say, if you've never been ill these questions won't even touch you.
Homeopathy: 'a little goes a long way' ..........
Dawkins:'empty vessels make the most noise'.

I'm new here, so I may be making a mistake, but I agree with chiongguo. You seem to be posting here in order to encourage argument. I don't think that a real homeopath would attack other people with long and aggressive rants, they would treat people who ask questions with kindness and compassion.

I also don't think a real homeopath would call themselves 'VeryScaryMary'. Homeopaths are trying to heal people, not frighten them. Unkind people have called me 'batty' because I use homeopathy. You just seem to be encouraging that kind of stereotype.

Where am I arguing?

I'm also a pacifist . Even when scolded, if it is appropriate I keep quiet. I never resort to violence but prefer to talk it out. I'm also honest to a fault and I will all a spade a spade, as I see it.

When I first joined a few alternative newsgroups/forum I had the opportunity to discuss and debate with many people. But there was a group of people who seem to support one position but always speak on behalf of the contrarian point of view. I did think much of it and then someone alerted me to such people that had been planted at the various alternative medicine newsgroups/forums. Some are very well trained, one person I debated with was a full-time write but a part-time alternative medicine saboteur.

So what are you ? It is not difficult to create an identity to convey the correct impression in the mind of the people reading your post in here. I've no need to create such an impression because I hope, that the people will read what I say for its own merit not because I'm somebody or had the proper credentials.

Even the most qualified can say the most innane things.

I went into the forum group you gave above but I found that YOU had deleted ALL your post there. But the reply to your post were still very much present and from what they say they actually have some really good question about YOUR understanding of homeopathy. Quite a number of the people there actually do understand homoeopathy quite well but unfortunately they do not believe in it. Understanding and belief are two different thing.


If we are to stand together why are you so keen on presenting the opposing point of view ? Shouldn't that be left to those who truly oppose homoeopathy ? Let them debate their point of view. At least in that case we know where they stand but the enemy from within is subtle and insidious. It kept planting seeds of doubt and negativity in the minds of the people and all along we never thought that their real intention is to poison the minds of the unsuspecting.

So why do you keep planting the seed of doubts in the name of free and open enquiry ?

My point was simple if you had read what I wrote. If you debate and discuss as a sceptic I'll engage you openly. But if you pretend to be supporting homoeopathy and then started planting seeds of doubts or problems with homoeopathy then what you are doing is insidious and have no place in the forum. Bring it out openly and then the readers can adjudge correctly where you are coming from.

Clap!clap!clap! You can see I'm quite sceptical of your posturing. Whether I'm a homoeopath or not is not important. What I believe in is. You could easily create an identity and then present it to the homoeopathic forum as a practitioner, a supporter, a championer of homoeopathy - like many such saboteurs in the past. What your identity is , is NOT important but what you do here is.

That's my contention.

You are right. You are not argueing but what you are doing is more insidious. You kept planting doubts, fear, uncertainties by your post on the one hand and then on the other hand pretend to be supporting homoeopathy.

Geezz...what we need more are one-handed homoeopaths

I am NOT planting seeds of doubt.
I am asking a question, which you haven't answered. Have you had experience of negativity towards you BECAUSE you are a Homeopath?
Yes, I removed my posts. I wrote them, they were mis-understood and now YOU are giving me a hard time by saying that they I shouldn't have removed them.
Where are we not seeing eye to eye?
How can you accuse me of planting seeds of doubt? Why the b****** hell would I want to do that, when I am a practicing Homeopath. I write Homeopathic articles for Homeopathic journals, I appear on BBC radio talking about, defending, explaining Homeopathy. You have done NO research on me other than to lay into me with stupid, juvenile ideas.
If you want to know about infiltrating etc then read the posts from
'Bethan'. 'She' is this bloke below:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>
shpalman
Rrrrrrrrrumba


Joined: 24 Apr 2007
Posts: 331
Location: Como, Italy
Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2007 10:41 pm
Post subject j wrote:Hey, they're looking for evidence based articles on homeopathy - http://www.otherhealth.com/showthread.php?p=77049#post77049

I wonder if the moderation is more/less strict than the mail?

Well it took quite a while for my registration there to be approved, but I haven't tried posting anything yet. I will of course try to be both polite and honest, because I don't have the imagination to make up the kind of genius fake loony comments which some of you lot have.


Opinions expressed in this posting are subject to change without notice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

When I post I put on my website address, my full name and my photo. You have a pseudonym, no website and no personal details.
Neither does 'she' and funny how she says she can't help

"I'm sorry but as I just use homeopathy I can't help"

Since when did a Homeopath, a TRUE Homeopath EVER say they can't help when there are over 2000 remedies in our Materia Medica?

This is my last post on this forum for another 4 years, because, once again, I come across someone who is unable to discuss, in a sensible manner, without going over the top, a sensible topic.
I'm too busy practicing Homeopathy and healing my patients to waste my time with someone who just likes to fight.

Fight on your own,

In peace
Mary
www.maryenglish.co.uk

But what you had posted continued to be plastered with subtle and actually downright gross suggestions of how homoeopathy doesn't work. What is the intent of all these ? Why also recount an incident that could evoke fear in others ? Why indeed ?

I'm a student of homoeopathy at the moment. Trained in physics. Taught for over 23 years as a lecturer.

So what has been treated negatively by others got anything to do with WHAT I HAD RAISED ? and i.e. why continue to put homoeopathy in the bad light while not even lifting a finger to show that the bad light were indeed wrong. You just plaster the doubt here and again what was your intention of doing that ?

I'm not giving you a HARD time because you had REMOVED your post. I'm pointing out what I see. If I'm wrong it is very simple to prove it ; defend homoeopathy DIRECTLY and stop posting articles after articles of how the sceptics are giving homoeopaths a hard time and then providing links to studies that show homeopathy was indeed false. On the one hand you say you support homoeopathy without giving evidences and then on the other hand, you provided opposing evidences to denigrate what you support. What's your intention here ?

It has nothing to do with seeing eye to eye over homoeopathy but the WAY in which you had used the forum to promote links and evidences that denigrate homoeopathy. My intent was to question your intent. It's that simple.

Those are not words of a pacifist . So you had done all those things. Great. Now defend homoeopathy in the appropriate manner and stop planting those articles and links that denigrate homoeopathy. Prove your worth as a true advocate of homoeopathy. People don't judge you from what I've said but by your own behaviour. I just pointed it out and it is for others to form their conclusion.

You still haven't answered what was your intention of planting those articles and links that denigrate homoeopathy and worst, gave a horrifying experience with the use of homoeopathy. What was your intention of such fear mongering ?

Don't know , don't care really. If Bethan were to write as you do I would consider contesting her way of presentation....I'm a student not only of homoeopathy but of chinese medicine (mainly acupuncture) and so my time is really limited. I write whenever I coud - on top of other obligations in my life.

You could give up this account and create another one and if you write sensibly I'll respond appropriately. It is NOT YOU but the MANNER in which you had posted. So why take it so PERSONALLY.

Even acting need props. On the internet, MANY - not ALL, know that identity could be easily faked. So we often judge the other person by what they say or do rather than who they are in real life. They can pretend to be the queen of england and if she behaves like a ruffian than people will act or react accordingly.

Btw. Chiongguo is my real name. You can look up
http://djhampa.spaces.live.com. Djhampa is my buddhist name. I've no need to hide.

On a side note, you are quite beautiful

I don't know who he is but after spending a bit of time at the badscience forum, just lurking, one thing I'm quite sure of is that the schalxxx guy won't use pseudonym. His ego is just too big.

I don't know who Bethan is but I think she's a gentle kindly lady.....but I could be wrong . But I won't lose any sleep over it for sure.

Viktor Frankl the "Will to Meaning" fame said that if you want to "help illuminate the path for others you should not be afraid of the heat."

I believe I had pointed out a very valid concern of a lot of people who are well-meaning in using homoeopathy. But because homoeopathy is beginning to make an in-road into modern medicine such a healing modality advancement has to be stopped. And the big pharma companies have a hell lot of money. From what I was told that these people were actually full-time worker just sitting there the whole day writing taunts, casting aspersion, denigrating, planting seeds of doubt, spreading a bit of fear etc. The approach is to misinform, disinform and spread outright lies. The quackwatch website is actually riddled with a lot of lies but who would take the trouble to check out all that they say was truthful. When I first looked at the website I endeavoured to check out a few things just to see how honest they are....they are not. They are actually very adept at twisting facts. The wordsmith that they had hired are really very good in giving false impression by the way they construct their sentences.

Oh..no...I'm actually a very peaceful person. I meditate a lot every day. I had been a victim of malicious rumour mongering for many years now and I know how these things can harm not only the person but even those who believed in it. While it is my karma and I accept it, I never go out to seek revenge or to harm another. I can say with confidence I've NOT HARMED another deliberately. I don't even harbour such thoughts and I often prayed for those who had harmed me.

Don't run away just because I had "given you a hard time". If you could really help others and are sincere about it why run away.


Metta,
Chiong

No, sorry, I'm not Bethan, and I don't know who Bethan is. Like I said in my post to badscience.net which you quote, I will try to be honest, because I don't have the imagination to pretend to believe in homeopathy.

Well said.

Yes, that's true, it is quite big.


Whether you believe me or not - you can find my true identity if you want to by following the link on my blog - I'm a physicist and not paid in any way by "big pharma", while there is a £38 million pound spend on homeopathy predicted for this year.

Dear veryscarymary,
I have not looked at this thread for a bit, so have only just realised what you have said about me. I am quite hurt by your slander. What justification do you have for accusing me of being this shpalman person? I am not he, not even of the same gender, and he has also stated this. Please, I would like an apology. I am a supporter of homeopathy, but your words and replies have disappointed me greatly.
Your comment about me not helping was quite mean. I have only ever said I use homeopathy, and my comment was meant to show that I haven't as much knowledge about remedies as proper homeopaths such as yourself. and to let the person know I hoped their mother got better.
I am at a loss to know how I have offended you. I'm sorry, I thought I would enjoy learning more about homeopathy on this site, but you have really made me upset by your attacks.
I do hope you learn to be at peace, because it seems like you have a disturbed outlook on life. Best wishes,
Bethan.