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Old 27th August 2001, 11:29 AM
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simone_M
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I would like to post a case for a friend of mine about her 4 year old son.
I have known this boy from birth and he has always shown signs of being deeply troubled, emotionally.
His temprament is agitated mostly toward his mother ( she says that he likes to wind him up )He will yell and scream at her for no apparent reason, and at any time of the day. He is hard to please and often finds things to throw tantrums at. As a younger child 2years he would cry wildly a lot, throw tantrums and could hardly ever be sedated. I would often help mum by taking him off her hands at playgroup and try to calm him which sometimes worked if I could divert his attention to something else.
Mum would often ignore him when he spoke and after constant bantering from child say " what " very loudly which was sometimes embarrasing. Mum might need treatment as well, which I have informed her of.
As a 4 year old I will try to give you and ex of some of his recent behaviour I have viewed in the last weeks.
Out in public he is demanding of mum, constantly wants her attention whether it be harsh or kind. Wants material things when shopping and usually wins due to constant harrasment and the soft option of not wanting to cause a scene in public. These scenes can get very graphic. He will throuw himself on the ground screaming wildly and becomes dazed. Mum will leave him where he is and not pay attention due to embarrasment.
If he doesnt throw himself on the ground he will attatch himself to mums legs and will not let go so she has to drag him around the floor.
I have weekly visits to the house and last week he became annoyed with mum as she turned the computer off after 4 hours of viewing ( very talented on computer -- took to it like crazy and know what to do, gets annoyed if you try to show him anything ).
He wet himself two days running instead of going to the toilet.
John bwcame agitated and attatched himself to mums legs crying wildly, She draged him around for about 5 minutes laughing nervously and not knowing how to handle him. A bath took his attention away, but the whole time in the bath he argued and cryed that he didnt want mum to be angry with him. When we both tried to tell him that she wasnt angry at him and she would smile, he would say that she was laughing aat him and she shouldnt do that. It became a round circle for about 10 minutes.
I found this to be very odd behaviour, he will rant for hours if you let him about not being angry then not laughing at him. Its like he gets things into his head and doesnt want them to change.
He has seen a child psycologist on home visits and they say he has passed their tests ok. Nothing wrong. He has had his hearing tested and only a small amount of fluid was found, nothing to worry about.
Although, I have often spoken to him and it is as though he doesnt hear you ( Preschool teacher commented on this only last week ).
He is very physcially active and veery sporting. Strong frame and muscular for his age, very balanced and picks up things like bike riding and skateboarding unbelievably fast.
His speech is slow and slurred which he sees a therapist for and is responding well.
His diet is ok -- mum is trying to become more healthy. He will eat meat and most vege if in the mood.
Will do most hings if in the mood.
Hates wearing anything but shorts and t-shirt, even in cold weather, hates wearing shoes.
I tried to put a singlet on him around two weeks ago as mum wasnt having any luck and he refused point blank. Had to have a specific shirt or wouldt co operate. Got very angry with me and then said I was laughing at him ( through tears ).
I asked dad to put his t- shirt and singlet on and he refused and said only I could put it on. I find this confused behaviour.
Mum took him in town last week and he wanted to get out of pram in bank, Mum said no and he went into tantrum mode. Mum didnt relent and they left. Got down the street and child wanted her to take him back to bank so he could get out there.
Sorry I am posting so long, but I keep coming up with eg as I have known him so long.
This behaviouris getting progressivly worse and mum is near tears in the last episode in supermarket. She turned around at people looking at her and yelled " waht are you looking at ". She is really a lovely lady, but not coping. To make matters worse, her youngest child (girl ) is showing same attributes.
Immunisations have been had. Allopathic meds taken most of the time, although I have introduced some herbal stuff.
Ther is heaps more to write, but I might let you ask q's first.
Any help would be wonderful.
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Old 27th August 2001, 12:10 PM
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Dear Simone,

Where IS everybody???

This case will require a lot of discussion. But what struck me was the
CAPRICIOUSNESS
OBSTINATE BEHAVIOUR
SHRIEKING

I would like to find out if there is any causative factor...some sort of sibling rivalry or insecurity due to the presence of a sibling or absence of a parent, etc. Still it does not warrant such a strong reaction!
Many remedies come to mind, but need to be qualified more deeply...
Tub, Cham, Cina,...

Lets see what the other's say.
doctorleela
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Old 27th August 2001, 12:32 PM
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Drleea, This child is the 2nd of 3. Ist girl age 6, him age 4 and youngest age 3. Mother found she was pregnant when breast feeding. The oldest child shows same symptoms but not as severe. At age 6 she is difficult, speaks very loudly and also throws tantrums. As a younger child, he behaviour was very similar. Mum thinks it is her fault, something to do with pregnancy. IMO she does have a need some help on child management and she will agree to this, but they get the better of her to often and she gives in and gets angry.
Mother works evenings and father works days. Father spends most night in shed having rlaxing drink with friends visiting ( I an hubby are some ) I end up looking after the kids, bathing,feeding entertaining etc, although they are capable of doing this themselves. Children get hurt alot, very accident prone family, more than most.
Children are very angry toward each other, more than most, john will hit younger sister. Younger sister will hit john over head with rock, john will knock amy off chair out of blue. That sort of thing.
Children dont get any real physical discipline, dad is lax on this, mumis very verbal and kids reciprocate. They all speak very loudly except dad.
Really nice people, easy to get along with, reasonably open minded, just dont really know how and why of parenthood. Love kids dearly though and I dont want to make them sound toooo negative to everyone.
Back to kids.
Last week he wanted a drink of juice, had to be juice in special glass, mum half filled, but not enough for him. He ranted for 10 minutes , mum added more, then went on about mum being angry at him over and over, then mum not laughing etc. Never did drink the drink, ended up in front of computer, eyes glued to screen.
Affectionate boy, loves to be cuddled, but only when he choses.
Stares off into distance alot, seems to question things he says in his own head after he has said them ( just a look he gets on his face leads me to this ).
Loves power ranges, hercules ( I lent him sons hercules pc game ), ninja turtles Buzz lightyear and woody. Banned from power ranges as he became violent. Swords have only been recently re introduced as he doesnt seem to relise that he could be hurting someone. Gets carried away with play. He hit my youngest son ( age 5 ) in the eye last week with big stick and cut his upper eyelid. Came in crying to mum and wringing his hands knowing that what he had done was wrong, but didnt want to be in trouble. Screamed frantically after he was told that although it was wrong he would be forgiven. My son would not take any appology from him. Plays foot ball with same son and is very strong, tackles like a rown boy of eight and has no worry about hurting himself, yet when blood appears, or he scratches himself, becomes frantic
Lots more to tell.......
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Old 27th August 2001, 02:18 PM
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I too thought about tuberculinum. But there is a lot of information needed....like, for example: when you say the child doesn't like to wear anything except a pair of shorts and a T shirt,even when its cold, why would you say this is so? Is it because he wants to challenge someone's authority? Is it because he simply will not stand still long enough to be dressed? Is it because he is simply one of those people who feels too hot--no matter what the temperature is around him--to wear anything else?

Does he have any physical ailments which recur? Any ear infections, or tendencies to flu or colds? Sore throats? Loss of voice or hoarseness (what with all that screaming?) Anything at all?

How about food preferences? (you may have mentioned this--but has anyone ever noticed his reactions to different foods? Like, for example, "every time he eats oranges, his temper flares?") Do you ever see an increase in that "hypnotized" behaviour in front of the computer--after he's had certain foods?

What is his sleep like? His dentition? What is his speech and learning ability re language like? Why does he not want to wear shoes--again, feet too hot? Shoes don't fit well? They make his feet hurt? Can't move around in the shoes as well as without?

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Old 27th August 2001, 03:49 PM
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Hi Simone,
My daughter (now 5) displays similar traits, although not so pronounced. The stubbornness about who can dress her, who can fill a glass with juice etc. is the very same. It seems as if it is directed at mom, but in fact it isn't. Tub. is her remedy and it works, although slowly.

Some tips for the mom would be to be totally consequent, i.e. follow through with what she "threatens". No refined sugar, not hours on end TV or Computer screens (I know it's tempting, for that will calm him down outwardly). There is a fantastic book out called "How to talk so your child will listen and how to listen, so your child will talk" by Elaine Mazlish and also by the same author "Siblings without rivalry".
My daughter's behavior got worse when her baby sister was born one year ago and is only now calming down somewhat. Perhaps mom finds time to spend some quality time with him 1 on 1 on a regular basis.
Good luck - Claudia
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Old 27th August 2001, 04:15 PM
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I find that often when a child need Tub. there is a line of hair down the spine.Please check for this.
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Old 27th August 2001, 10:17 PM
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Sounds to me like all 3 kids need proper discipline and the parents need to learn parenting fast

Kids are very very good at playing one parent off against the other and realising when there are no tram lines to walk between

Our grandson behaves perfectly in his home or ours where the rules are the rules and the same but let him go to the other grandparents and he is allowed to do totally what he likes including eating sweets instead of lunch ......... goes home and tries same at home to no avail ........comes to us next day just as badly behaved until given a real talking too and told we will phone his Mum .......it takes 2 seconds for the good boy to return

Children behave badly when they are allowed to run riot and totally spoilt getting everything they demand
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Old 27th August 2001, 10:25 PM
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Hi everyone -- time differences have delayed my post. I have only just got up !!
After reading your poast this mornI can give you a few anwsers to your questions.

The clothes issue in my and hubbys opinion is a challanging thing. He knows that he will get away with it if he hassles or kic uenough fuss, He does have favourites with clothing though. Like a shirt with a certain picture on it ( likes most of these )and with hassle and carry on even if it is in the machine to be washed.
His head does feel hot ocassionally, but not always. As I said he is very active, always running and bike riding, climbing, so this would be reason for not wanting clothes on also.
He likes to feel the ground under his feet -- but also a challange thing. Everything seems to point toward mum in his responses as I have asked him to do the same things mum has and he has done them with little fuss. I can usually talk him around so to speak.
I was thinking last night about when he first showed disruptive signs and I seem to remember it to be at about the age of 4 to 6 months, becoming more noticable when he had his own range of movement. Jealousy could be a factor as children are very close in age.
Up until the early ages ( 4months ) he was a beautiful baby, slept well and would always smile and cuddle.
His health is reasonable, suffered small amount of childhood illness. The usual colds going about and recently him and younger sister had the chickenpox, but only mild dosage. No real trauma with this.
Eats a variety of food, mostly processes, loves meat especially chicken, eats processed food and afternoon snacks.
Drinks a lot, mostly juice ( usually pure fruit juice ) and some water. I will ask mum if there are any foods that upset.
Sleep patterns have changed considerably. Was not a good sleeper. Mum would be up thoroughout the night for the first 3 years. ANd he is a very early riser 5am onwards. Now has a water bed ( everyone in family does ) and he sleep a lot better.
Was very easy to toilet train.
Speech isnt good ( therapy ) and he is very childish in his usage of language. Says " rink " for drink . etc I worked on this last week and had him saying drink. He thought it was great and for the next 1/2 hour walked around saying drink , but would lapse back into " rink " in conversation ( normal for child his age )
Anyone with a knowledge of iridology ( is this used in Homeopathy as a diagnostic ? ), he has a exceptionally obvious white nerve wreath. and bright blue eyes.
Any more q's ?
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Old 27th August 2001, 10:32 PM
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Just forgot to mention:
Tells mum he loves her when in trouble. Will say this over and over and doesnt stop when mum acknoledges.
Dentition is good. Strong teeth. B
Better movement wthout shoes on.
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Old 27th August 2001, 10:37 PM
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Dear Simone,

This is definitely why the Ullmans wrote Ritalin-Free Kids and Rage-Free Kids, and maybe it would be advisable to order these at www.minimum.com.

Does he throw the covers off at night? What is his sleep position? How does he feel about orange juice, and sour fruit like green apples? How does he feel about milk?
Bacon?

What's he afraid of? Dogs? The dark? Bathing? etc.

Any night terrors?

The clinging makes me want to think of stramonium, but I'll reserve judgement for now.

Try to think of what traits he has that aren't common in ADHD.

Thanks,
Snoopy
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